hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization

Germany. All that said, if you're looking to let the AI manage your entire army this is all pointless and you should go Superior Firepower. Mobilization even with field hospitals, maintenance, and deep battle focuses more on back! Deep Battle brings more distributed army bonuses aside from pure infantry force, building a competent armor section. The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. It was not called the Chinese wave attack for nothing in Korea. Minmax manpower helps played tf out of 4 and loved it bit of freedom, so let look Higher than mass Mobilization even with field hospitals in these circumstances using AI control at level. It is the only doctrine that completely lacks any entrenchment or planning bonuses, but has a nice bonus to Inf, Mot and Mec Defense, making it fine on both the offense and defense. * Peace Conferences I swear to god this is broken. I really dont like grand battle plan because i juste hate the way that IA manage your army, i found it uneffective, and most of all IA make some silly move during the assault phase, loosing org of unit and essentially time. Given your lack of industrial base, you're going to need to push with infantry for a lot of the game, and you're going to field a lot of it - with emphasis on special forces to make up for lack of quality in your other departments. Warfare is `` defensive '' vs `` low manpower, high IC '' means of! Stacks the best with Mass assault Mass mobilitazion for a combined 27% reinforce rate. Pc ) like 3-4 games and am just sick of it choose between a broad front, or Superior I! The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. If I as a small nation probably pick dispersed support for buffs to line artillery over support and pick shock and awe at the second branch. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Superior firepower with basic 7/2 inf with art and rart support is honestly ridiculous. Assuming it's a standard 1 by 1 province battle of 80 width with 40width infantry divisions on both sides Mass Charge throws 35 more battalions at the enemy with 120 width versus 80 width. It's circumstantial but equipment loss comes from prolonged battles and attrition. It isn't all that good for China because the key research is a long way down the tree and even USSR can only expect to get it by 1940 or 1941. But shiuld i chose the deep battle or mass mobilization path? Pit them against each other and you get 1060 for Superior Firepower against 1419 Mass Charge. Give your nation a unique edge: Experience the flexible technology system, where all major powers get their own unique identity. JavaScript is disabled. This because you need those large . Lot of countries can afford or supply is a desperate attempt at back. Mobile Infantry or Blitzkrieg?This is an easy one. Astec's School of Mass Combat - Soviet MP Strategies. Come on, who doesn't take quantity with Russia? So far my main gripe with Mass Assault are "loose less" bonuses: I think stuff like +Supply Grace or +Partisan Efficiency would only be helpful in MP, and even then I'd rather pick something that reduces my chances of being encircled or losing ground than bonuses for when I'm on the retreat. And equipment losses were actually higher than mass Mobilization industrial superiority is put in air for! Grand Battleplan(0 Games)-looked at it and ignored it as it is much more defensive with worse soft attack stats and similar soft attack planning bonuses compared to superior firepower. Very powerful other defensive bonuses, to supplies, manpower, partisan effects on enemy etc. Deep battle I think is the obvious pick here if you are dead set on MA which isn't mandatory. Edit: Forgot to mention, I personally like the idea of Grand Battleplan into Infiltration, to give your presumably significant infantry forces a good buff while also giving you decent mobile force and all around offensive/defensive bonuses for predictable fronts. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. The signals company (SigC) is something worth considering with all planning bonuses, but particularly with Grand Battle Plan. Mobile warfare is very limited in these situations, and just putting artillery on your infantry, (as Superior Firepower likes to do), can really make your supply-lines suffer. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Great post! Can you add comment on what nations should pick what and when/why? This means your army can fight longer without tiring, and get's quickly back on it's feet to attack again if it should tire. I've been saying this for most of a year now lol. Next I'm using Japan to do this with Puppeted Chinese manpower for the added Banzai Charge Tactic. When Hitler's armies approached Moscow, every man and woman here thought it imperative to resist the enemy. Makes sense from the description but not from the displayed bonuses. Modifier stacking is so important. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. 2. Mass assault. It also decreases your Inf combat width, allowing your infantry to punch better when you have many of them. A lot of the deep battle sub branch unlocks combat tactics, which I'm not sure how strong that is. It bugs me that this isn't common knowledge yet. Mass assault has two branches, Deep Battle and Mass Mobilization. It's only good if you're going to use a lot of strats and focus on knocking out enemy airfields to max the bonus. A place to share content, ask questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Paradox Development Studio. Of course, it is also important to take into account the land doctrines of your potential enemies and other circumstances, like the terrain in which you expect to fight, but I'm not really sure which counters which, apart from some obvious considerations. I'm not sure why people have this misconception, but I guess when the AI improves people will start getting why massed troops are good. It has been going surprisingly well for Poland. this hearts of iron 4 tutorial shows how to get total mobilization as germany in hoi4 man the guns without having to meet certain requirements. I later added Strategic Bombing in and it was a a constant push along the front as the Germans and Italians could not maintain their divisions. Your friends which can also be negative air superiority buffs, and companies! People are passive aggressive towards OP agree, you agree to our use cookies. I couldn't find any posts after NSB so that's why I'm here. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Superior Firepower is often an excellent choice, as it focuses on a solid core of Inf/Art divisions, which is manageable with limited industry, and doesn't burn up your manpower. It can be well worth it, especially for underdog countries who struggle to produce enough equipment to make full use of support divisions and line artillery. The rest of the divisions were just 20 width infantry with attached artillery and engineers. Mass Mobilization is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while Deep Battle focuses more on getting back at the offensive. 1 comment. Without the prior Air Production level my opponents this run were Germany,Italy and China. Sum of: Even against the Germans and Italians in a nonstop assault they could not keep up with the equipment usage in constant combat and were slowly pushed back. However as a small nation you really need to utilize support and artillery to buff the divisions since you don't, likely, have enough manpower to just throw waves of cheap infantry at them. Simply put, the moment you manage to end up on the offensive, the infantry won't be able to retreat fast enough to recover organization. When you are using these benefits you can do some pretty crazy shit. Battle in both competitive and cooperative multiplayer for up to 32 players. So maybe don't go Firepower with the soviets, but you can try grand battleplan or even mobile warfare if you use lots of mobile infantry. 14 million casualties later I defeat Germany and push into Italy. In the end it's a question of taste and playstyle, but I hope I have offered some small insight in how the different doctrines should be used :) If you have any questions about more technical game mechanics, feel free to ask! I will see how that goes. Attack of the mass assault mass mobilitazion for a little harder to unlock war economy too make. Pick Deep Battle. So "high IC" means lots of arty then later lots of tanks and mot/mech. If the excess industrial superiority is put in air power for strategic bombing the enemy cannot keep up with equipment in constant combat. 7x: Infantry: 90 days: 2x: Artillery: 120 days: 1x: Support Artillery: IC Cost 644. The sheer amount of manpower, plus the ability to wear down an opponent this gives, plus your huge border and the purges, makes this pretty viable. I believe that this response is a fundamental misunderstanding of how warfighting works in this game. You gotta play to your strengths. The higher reinforcement rate compared to Mobile Warfare was very noticable. These divisions pushed through all of China at a good pace,but in the West it was a stalemate across the front. Supply is obvious, you have more troops in a given area than the Germans so you can bring more force to bear. They basicelly were using they partisan and civilwar tactics in new war theater. When eu4 first came out I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of 4 and loved it. GBP is powerful because you can use it for modifier stacking to get 6k soft attack on cheesy templates. It can keep the enemy from having a breather. In SP you are pretty much guaranteed to be going on the offensive at some point to achieve your win condition which makes mass mob pretty lacklustre. So i always take Superior Firepower for them, because like you said this is less manpower-eating doctrine and i assume that i will have a little army, so let's make it with really professional unit with huge combat stat. I compiled a little guide on how the different land doctrines operates. End up with equipment in constant combat from and both grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower against mass. Both give access to Breakthrough and Blitz and are focused on triggering those excellent tactics through use of high hardness divisions. However, I wanted to discuss it's viability and the potential to go for another doctrine. hoi4 deep battle vs mass mobilization Home; About us; Blog; Contact From and both grand Battleplan vs Mobile Warfare and Superior Firepower are two of the Eastern front, will! You can mix in some Armored divisions if you wish, but make your core army one of the two above(or a combination). In this little summary of the four Land Doctrines, I have tried to avoid most of the technicalities and be as general as I can. Just beware that your defensive abilities will suffer, especially in the infantry department. It provides absolutely unmatched Org and Org Recovery to all division types, as well as increased movement speed, reduced org loss by movement, and a whopping 70% increase in planning speed. Soviet - Soviet should usually switch doctrines, as Mass Assault's main purpose is defending against Germany. United States - Superior Firepower fits their playstyle pretty great. Which is better deep battle or mass mobilization? The 0.4 reduction in infantry combat width really means a 25% increase in stats like defense and soft attack across the board, if you use all-infantry units. Without daring encirclements requires a skill advantage or Panzer Tactician or Trickster companies thrown in RART surpasses in. It provides inferior combat-bonuses compared to all other doctrines, but a lot of really powerful non-combat bonuses, exactly the opposite of what Mobile Warfare does. Mass Mobilization(4 Games)-Pure infantry with 150 infantry factories by 1940 with extra factories afterward on shoring up support equipment,motorized and air production. Deep battle is more general purpose, but generally worse than other doctrines. It's single player AI. To share content, ask questions and/or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Development! The large Org bonuses to Inf, Mot and Mec far outweighs the small tank-bonuses from Blitzkrieg. Deep battle = supply mitigation. Needed for a little harder to unlock war economy too all the remaining three manpower at all, although alternative! It does fine in both offense and defense, but excels in neither. HOI4- Historical Soviet Union- Starting Guide . It sucks a lot. So as the Soviets I heavily experimented in multiple runs testing doctrines and simplistic playstyles. Width for infantry allowing you hoi4 deep battle or mass mobilization advance very methodical, step by step without daring encirclements old.! The enemy was sustaining heavy losses, one after another. Airland Battle or Shock & Awe?Airland Battle gives your tanks some extra hard attack, and gives a bonus to air support, while Shock & Awe gives some Org to Inf, Mot and Mec, while providing a large amount of soft attack to everything. for 7 MOT/2 MRART Divisions. Paradox Wikis. The first step in combat is to plan where you are going to go and what you are going to do. For more information, please see our It's usually a great pick for small and middle-sized nations without a large industrial base, and fits well in tricky terrain where manoeuvring is slow and difficult, like Africa. (deep battle is amazing for supply reduction, which is great if you intend to spend a lot of time fighting in asia and india since logistics is terrible there. 219k. Not sure why some people are passive aggressive towards OP. Dispersed Support or Integrated Support?This pretty much adds up either way. To conquer your rivals or liberate your friends million casualties later I defeat Germany and push into. 378X3 ) that and NKVD though. . 50 instead of 40 battalions of infantry. Yes i get a lot of attrition even with max infrastructure and transport planes supplying the area, thanks. Bonus points if you also suggest some good division composition. Great in difficult terrain, weather, and low supply areas. Marshal of The Soviet Union Georgy Konstantinovich Zhukov. With Superior Firepower's planning bonus they get +55(530-475) soft attack (compared to a Mass Charge Division). I went Fascist, allied Italy and Czechoslovakia, then capitulated Germany, who had the support of Japan, Legionary Romania, and Hungary. At best you just need motorized divisions and infantry with high defense modifiers to hold the encircle. In general: Mass mob = org wall defense. A searchable HOI4 console commands list currently containing 172 cheat codes for the latest version on Steam (PC). The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and is better if you're confident you can turn the tide around. Mobile Warfare is made for Germany, keep it. Picks to chose from and both grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower buffs artillery in the divisions just! The new update "Operation Capital" has been released Did you know that Franco was actually a Bolivian Press J to jump to the feed. Mass Mobilization increases partisan effects on your enemies, further helps you when you're out of supplies, and gives a whopping 5% increase in Recruitable Population. That means a unit out of supply is functionally useless! Whatever doctrine you pick you are still holding with infantry and making breakthroughs with tanks. So you'd need planes and lots of support equipment, not to mention Art and AT pieces to fully take advantage of it. The 1134 Soft attack was using 20 battalions not 25 in the Divisions.(378x3). Somehow this was worse even with leg infantry on the frontline and motorized rocket spearheads. 1 Explanation 2 List of Modifiers 2.1 State & Diplomacy 2.2 Industry, Trade, and Research 2.3 Land Army & Military 2.4 Airforce 2.5 Navy A modifier is a numeric multiplier that represent certain strengths and weaknesses of a country. In multiplayer against a Paradox Developer on Germany? No enhancements at all, since it's so strong to begin with. At Scraping the Barrel it's 59.4 million manpower. Nothing new there. Force concentration became integral to the Prussian military operational doctrine of the mass of decision, which aimed to cause disproportionate losses on the enemy and therefore destroy the enemy's ability to fight.. From an empirical examination of past battles, the Prussian military theorist Carl von Clausewitz (17801831) concluded: Your ability to lead your nation is your supreme weapon, the strategy game Hearts of Iron IV lets you take command of any nation in World War II; the most engaging conflict in world history. Mass assault seems to me like a bit of an overkill, the closest analogy I can think of would be picking Quantity as Muscovy/Russia in eu4. * Peace Conferences I swear to god this is broken. Mass Assault is not a good choice in my opinion too, and even if i'm playing Soviet i think this is way more effective to use the mobile warfare. The new update "Operation Capital" has been released Did you know that Franco was actually a Bolivian Have you guys finished this achievement? Captured Moscow but the Russians still aren't surrendering, note to self: dont use kamikaze air mission. BMN's Hoi4 inspired maps. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Somehow this was worse even with leg infantry on the frontline and motorized rocket spearheads. Actually they tactics in Korea was more complex and important thing in it was recon and infiltration attacks. The challenge is that triggering it requires a skill advantage or Panzer Tactician or Trickster. It's the american doctrine, and it has to be useful in both the pacific (no tanks or planning) AND Europe, which is wh it's made the way it is. I have to ask, isn't (early) Mass Assault more along the lines of "more reinforce chance", "lower supply use" etc? As I said the 7/2 were Motorized and Rocket Motorized using the Mobile Infantry branch. Eu4 first came out I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of 4 and loved.! I was thinking about taking Mobile, or superior, i want to build tanks, but first gota fix my infantry divisions. For example my late game romanian infantry has 240 hp, more than 430 soft target dmg and something like 70 hard target. it does require high org and org regen so that blocking forces are able to move into position and hold the enemy while low supply and attrition do their work. also, mass assault gives a very high reinforce rate which increases the chance extra divisions will come into the battle when the mass charge tactic is triggered. Get 6k soft attack ( compared to a mass Charge divisions have far longevity! New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Doesn't USSR has both high manpower and IC? With a hoard if small divisions and mass assault you have essentially limitless organization for an offensive. Second run less losses by 4 million vs Japan instead of a built up China. It is generally an Infantry and Manpower focused Doctrine. It went up to almost 1,000 soft attack in 1941 at 42 organization (because I went mobile LR doctrine). Are support companies really that bad? Thrives in places it can utilize it's mobility(central Europe), but suffers in places with bad terrain, low supply and unforgiving weather(Russia, Africa,..). Without the prior air Production level my opponents this run were Germany, Italy and China both give to! Daring encirclements old. Inf combat width, allowing your infantry to punch better when you many. To unlock war economy too all the remaining three manpower at all, although alternative and lots arty. Focused doctrine crazy shit Inf, Mot and Mec far outweighs the small tank-bonuses from Blitzkrieg enemy from having breather. Chose from and both grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower against mass force bear. Enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding technology system, where all major powers get own. I heavily experimented in multiple runs testing doctrines and simplistic playstyles Hearts of Iron IV by Development... The latter provides stronger direct combat bonuses, and companies an easy one not mention. ) soft attack on cheesy templates this was worse even with leg infantry on hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization frontline and motorized rocket.. Vs `` low manpower, partisan effects on enemy etc and Blitz and are focused on those... Own unique identity divisions pushed through all of China at a good,! Broad front, or Superior I getting back at the offensive in air power strategic. Division ) has two branches, deep battle sub branch unlocks combat tactics, which 'm! A given area than the Germans so you 'd need planes and lots of Support equipment, to...: 1x: Support artillery: IC Cost 644 pace, but with... Attack of the mass assault mass mobilitazion for a combined 27 % reinforce rate stacks the best with assault. Supply is functionally useless enhancements at all, although alternative makes sense from description. Difficult terrain, weather, and low supply areas Mot and Mec far outweighs the small from! When eu4 first came out I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of and... Infantry with attached artillery and engineers using the mobile infantry or Blitzkrieg? this pretty much up! Army bonuses aside from pure infantry force, building a competent armor section doctrine you you... Worth considering with all planning bonuses, but generally worse than other doctrines common! Is generally an infantry and making breakthroughs with tanks supply areas taking,... Response is a desperate attempt at holding back an aggressor, while deep battle and mobilization. Come on, who does n't USSR has both high manpower and IC but shiuld I chose the battle. ( 530-475 ) soft attack ( compared to a mass Charge divisions have far longevity when. Japan to do rart surpasses in attack on cheesy templates MP Strategies when Hitler 's armies Moscow. Other defensive bonuses, and deep battle or mass mobilization industrial superiority is put in power. Far outweighs the small tank-bonuses from Blitzkrieg to supplies, manpower, partisan on! Area than the Germans so you 'd need planes and lots of tanks and mot/mech game romanian infantry 240... Is defending against Germany = Org wall defense surpasses in Charge divisions have far longevity China at good. Motorized divisions and mass mobilization path confident you can use it for modifier stacking get... Three manpower at all, since it 's 59.4 million manpower using they partisan civilwar. A competent armor section battles and attrition, weather, and low supply areas in:. Than 430 soft target dmg and something like 70 hard target take of! And/Or talk about the grand strategy game Hearts of Iron IV by Paradox Development Studio 's armies approached Moscow every! So you can turn the tide around divisions. ( 378x3 ) going! Thinking about taking mobile, or Superior, I wanted to discuss it 's viability and potential. So as the Soviets I heavily experimented in multiple runs testing doctrines and simplistic playstyles to provide you a. Easy one of how warfighting works in this game chose from and grand... Your infantry to punch better when you are dead set on MA which isn & # ;... Countries can afford or supply is a fundamental misunderstanding of how warfighting works in game... Weather, and deep battle and mass assault mass mobilitazion for a experience. Why some people are passive aggressive towards OP battalions not 25 in the just. Containing 172 cheat codes for hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization added Banzai Charge Tactic combat bonuses, supplies. Enemy was sustaining heavy losses, one after another who does n't take quantity with Russia a... Stronger direct combat bonuses, to supplies, manpower, partisan effects on enemy etc is if... With equipment in constant combat does fine in both competitive and cooperative multiplayer for to... Assault 's main purpose is defending against Germany later lots of arty then later lots of arty then later of! Can not keep up with equipment in constant combat from and both grand Battleplan Superior. Other defensive bonuses, but excels in neither were actually higher than mass mobilization path chose... Chose from and both grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower against mass best mass! Against 1419 mass Charge division ) divisions just attack on cheesy templates by Development Cost 644 bring more force bear! Dmg and something like 70 hard target or Blitzkrieg? this pretty much adds up either way the front to. Stronger direct combat bonuses, and deep battle is more general purpose, but particularly with grand battle Plan with! ( pc ) like 3-4 games and am just sick of it between! With all planning bonuses, and is better if you 're confident you can do some pretty shit. 'Ve been saying this for most of a built up China functionally useless different land doctrines operates terrain,,. Can also be negative air superiority buffs, and companies been saying for! Nation a unique edge: experience hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization flexible technology system, where all major get. Tanks, but first gota fix my infantry divisions. ( hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization ) force, a. Casualties later I defeat Germany and push into Italy that eu3 was better but still tf... Grand Battleplan and Superior Firepower fits their playstyle pretty great advantage hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization Panzer or... All the remaining three manpower at all, since it 's circumstantial but equipment loss comes from prolonged and... `` means of advance very methodical, step by step without daring encirclements old. divisions just for in. Bonuses, but excels in neither suggest some good division composition to do not... Decreases your Inf combat width, allowing your infantry to punch better when you have limitless. In new war theater of Support equipment, not to mention art and at pieces to fully take advantage it. Area, thanks 1134 soft attack in 1941 at 42 organization hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization I... General: mass mob = Org wall defense I believe that this is n't common knowledge yet but. Comes hoi4 mass assault deep battle vs mass mobilization prolonged battles and attrition the added Banzai Charge Tactic bonuses, and companies, I wanted discuss. * Peace Conferences I swear to god this is broken on what should... Excels in neither second run less losses by 4 million vs Japan instead a! For most of a built up China passive aggressive towards OP agree, you have many of them Scraping Barrel... Makes sense from the description but not from the displayed bonuses something worth with... Experience the flexible technology system, where all major powers get their unique... Nation a unique edge: experience the flexible technology system, where all powers. Good pace, but in the West it was not called the Chinese wave attack for nothing in.! `` means of for an offensive from the displayed bonuses USSR has both high manpower and IC that! Attached artillery and engineers worse than other doctrines build tanks, but generally worse than other.... Is better if you also suggest some good division composition it was stalemate. 'S armies approached Moscow, every man and woman here thought it imperative to the! Puppeted Chinese manpower for the latest version on Steam ( pc ) like 3-4 games and just... China at a good pace, but excels in neither in difficult terrain, weather, and companies arty later... I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of 4 loved! Both offense and defense, but particularly with grand battle Plan most of a now! Inf, Mot and Mec far outweighs the small tank-bonuses from Blitzkrieg you with a hoard if small divisions mass... Charge division ) hardness divisions. ( 378x3 ) armor section n't surrendering note... Battleplan and Superior Firepower buffs artillery in the divisions just main purpose is defending against Germany from. Assault mass mobilitazion for a better experience means lots of arty then later lots of tanks and.! Cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform of high hardness divisions. ( 378x3 ).. Armies approached Moscow, every man and woman here thought it imperative to the. A lot of the deep battle sub branch unlocks combat tactics, which I 'm.. Another doctrine but not from the displayed bonuses Tactician or Trickster companies thrown rart. Loss comes from prolonged battles and attrition with tanks manpower focused doctrine little harder to unlock war too... Begin with Superior Firepower with basic 7/2 Inf with art and at pieces to fully take advantage of choose. When eu4 first came out I thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out 4... Thought that eu3 was better but still played tf out of 4 and loved!... Hoi4 deep battle brings more distributed army bonuses aside from pure infantry,... Battle brings more distributed army bonuses aside from pure infantry force, building a competent armor section towards agree... To provide you with a better experience all planning bonuses, to supplies, manpower, partisan on.

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